Larry’s Log

Sep 08 2006

A shout of support to Ms Mariyah Moten

Young, fit women in tasteful bikinis are always a joy to me. Unlike some, I don’t view a tasteful bikini as clothing meant to objectify women but as a symbol of women’s sufferage. Can you imagine trying to swim in something like a burqa?

With that in mind, I’d like to ask you to join in with me in supporting Mariyah Moten in her win as ‘Best in Media’ title - for being the most photographed and interviewed contestant - at the pageant in the Chinese resort of Beihai.

A prize winning bikini contest model who claimed she was the Pakistani representative has sparked outrage in the predominantly muslim country.

Stunning Mariyah Moten, 22, won the ‘Best in Media’ title - for being the most photographed and interviewed contestant - at the pageant in the Chinese resort of Beihai.

But furious Pakistani authorities say she did not have permission to represent the country, where many women only go out in public covered in a veil.

If this had been a string bikini or some other tiny garment that was made to objectify women I could understand the Pakistani response. Not this bikini, though. No, this bikini was just right for Ms Moten.

Human Rights | Larry D. Burton | 08 September 2006 |

42 Comments

By Felix Miller, 9/13/2006 @ 1:31 pm

The sad part about this situation is that Ms. Moten may be in danger of losing her life. I do not understand the depth of hatred some Moslems feel for those who do not meet their rigid standards of modesty and chastity. For me, both of those are matters of taste, as you remarked about “objectifying” women.

And, yes, a shout out for Ms. Moten for sure. She is beautiful.
By V3, 9/14/2006 @ 4:13 am

Being a Pakistani and Moslem, I wholly support Ms. Moten.

I am 25 and definitely believe that it’s her right.

To represent Pakistan or not is another issue which will be raised by the hard-liners of the Pakistani political scene and if the President does condemn Ms. Moten, I can honestly say it will be so to appease the extremist political parties operating in the Pakistani political scenario.
By atif, 9/16/2006 @ 1:10 am

Mariyah moten, is a role model and a true symbol of what pakistani women should follow.
smart, pretty, confident and BOLD.

She will be the greatest thing for pakistan
By Larry D. Burton, 9/18/2006 @ 8:49 pm

Feel free to continue to comment here but if you want to get into a further discussion you can do it here.
By Usman, 9/25/2006 @ 11:19 am

Thank god, this is the first place on the net where I see positive responses on Miss Mariyah, most other places are infested with extremists who dumbfully critisize her along with jealous Westeners and Indians.
But I’m sure this place will also soon find an extremist’s comment that will cause a division in our opinions.
By Larry D. Burton, 9/25/2006 @ 12:45 pm

Dissenting comments are always welcome here.
By Nitasha, 9/30/2006 @ 6:46 pm

I am also glad to see a website that supports my friend Mariyah Moten. She has been a smart, passionate and charismatic girl since high school. Mariyah has always had a passion to do what she is doing now. And she does it with style and class. She is a devoted muslim woman. She is in no way, shape or form disrespecting her culture. She is simply trying to pursue a long time dream. I support her all the way and will continue to.
By Nasir, 10/14/2006 @ 2:33 pm

I don’t know why a beautiful Pakistani girl wearing a bikini is such a big issue? Pakitanis are hypocrites…they do all their dirty deeds behind closed doors and that’s what irks me. If Mariyah Moten was Turkish, Central Asian or Tunisian then there would be little public or government reaction. Pakistan seems to think it is the beholder of the Islam. I think it’s great to finally see a silver lining in the dark age imposed by General Zia ul Haq from 1977 onwards - I just hope people like Mariyah withstand the ‘Islamist storm’ and continue towards the liberal trend…not everyone’s the same & wants to look like a ‘black ghost’ (burqa). For me, she’s the 2nd gutsy lady to challenge the hypocrisy since Meera starred in ‘Nazar’ but she seems to have succumbed to the negative reaction.
By Zoya, 10/18/2006 @ 5:42 am

I am also glad that one to the pakistani girl took a step and come forward put the nation in front. I am happy and i also like to join the group and aims of miss mariyah. I blessed her for his great motivation. I also advise her to took part in the hollywood movies, bollywood and lollywood movies. And there is no botheration if u like to took part in x rated movies. We will appreciate also in this step.
By ahmed, 10/21/2006 @ 6:44 pm

What Ms Mariya Moten has done is indeed breaking not only a barrier but also a taboo. The savage rehortic so aggressively shown back home is just another..doing for the sake of doing stuff. Dont be worried or bogged down by them is the message of Miss Pakistan. It is by brave girls like you appreciation comes globally for the beauty amongst the beasts we have in this part of the world
By Ickraash Baig, 11/7/2006 @ 2:46 pm

I would like to see Felix Miller,V3,atif,Larry D. Burton,Nitasha,Nasir,Zoya,ahmed their sisters and mothers wearing the same clothes that she is wearing. She is muslim and doing things that muslims are not allowed to do and are forbidden by God. If you agree to send me pictures of ur mother and sisters wearing what she is wearing please send a bar of SOAP with it too this way i donot have 2 use my own SOAP. and for everyone whoever left the comment supporting her please lets take it to next level and send me naked pictures of ur mom and sisters i would prefer their boobs b visible in the pictures
Thanks
Reply back josh@cyscosoft.com please use subject pictures
By jiah, 11/15/2006 @ 8:23 am

You go, Mr. Baig. i totally agree with u. for all those stupid people out there who say mariyah is representing her culture and means no disrespect, let me point out: her culture is based on her religion which is Islam.Nowhere in Islam does it say that women can expose themselves like that. A muslim women is chaste, modest and shows her body only to her husband.According to her friends, “Mariyah is a devoted muslim woman”. i beg to differ. “devoted muslim women” do not take their clothes off in public. For all of you fools out there who think of her as a role model and would like to follow in her footsteps, be warned! the only place Mariyah Moten is leading you is straight to HELL!!!!
By Larry D. Burton, 11/15/2006 @ 12:01 pm

Actually, I find that bathing suit to be quite modest.
By jiah, 11/15/2006 @ 1:14 pm

No offense, Mr. Burton. But your views of modest and a Muslim’s view of modest are two different things. Bottom line: Mariyah as a Muslim should never have bared herself like that.End of story.
By Larry D. Burton, 11/15/2006 @ 1:46 pm

I think it would depend on the Muslim. Would it not?
By jiah, 11/15/2006 @ 11:56 pm

No,it would not. Islam is not just a religion, its a way of life. It is explained in the Quran in detail. All spelled out in black and white. Whether one’s an African American Muslim, Arab Muslim, Asian Muslim or even Caucasian Muslim,we all follow the Quran in the same way. There are no shades of grey.If you call yourself a Muslim, you follow the word of Allah. You cannot put your own spin on it.
By Larry D. Burton, 11/16/2006 @ 3:29 pm

So you are telling me that all Muslims see things the same way? Shi’a and Sunni alike? The Quran tells exactly how much flesh a woman can expose in public? A hand only? A hand and a wrist but not the forearm? or some similar method so that there is no shade of grey in making these decisions?
By jiah, 11/16/2006 @ 9:16 pm

A Muslimah (a Muslim woman) has to cover her hair and neck. Her arms should be covered to the wrist.Her legs covered all the way to the ankles.Her clothing should be loose so that the shape of her body is not clearly outlined. This is for all muslimah’s. Due to their cultural background some women wear veils, gloves and socks. the effect is a woman totally covered but it is not mandatory.
By jiah, 11/17/2006 @ 9:08 am

In this matter, yes. Women have to cover their hair and neck. Their arms should be covered to their wrists and legs covered to the ankles.Their clothing should be loose so as to not outline their body shape.In some cultures, women take it a few steps further by wearing gloves, veils and socks.
But that is not mandatory.
By Larry D. Burton, 11/17/2006 @ 12:28 pm

Jiah, I appologize for my spam filters. Something about those last two comments triggered my filters and they ended up in a moderation queue.

Now, I’m very interested in what you have to say and I have questions. Please don’t take them the wrong way, but are Muslim men required to cover themselves in the same manner? If not, why not?
By topspin, 11/19/2006 @ 12:42 pm

Jiah, I appreciate your passion for Islam, but the “deed is done” by this young lady, the pic is out there, and it’s not going away.

This quote from The Holy Koran 24:31 “And say to the believing women that they cast down their looks and guard their private parts and do not display their ornaments except what appears thereof, and let them wear their head-coverings over their bosoms, and not display their ornaments except to their husbands or their fathers….” certainly suggests this young lady has some explaining to do.

I’ll give that respect and I think this young lady should also if she wishes to claim Islam as her faith.

So, what is her just punishment? Beating by the mutawwiin? Excommunication? Ah, but there is no excommunication in Islam. No, I believe those Muslims who defy the Koran and refuse to repent (as this young lady appears to be doing) are deemed worthy of a different punishment. Perhaps you could tell us what it is, Jiah? Perhaps you WOULD suggest a punishment for this young, rebellious Muslim lady?
By jiah, 11/21/2006 @ 2:53 am

Hey Topspin. Let me commend you on your knowledge of Islam. Since you know so much about the religion, you probably know that if a muslim commits a wrongful act, it is the duty of other muslims to show them the right way. This works twofold. The person committing the act, realizes their mistake and repents. Also it prevents others from committing the same error.
In the case of Miss Moten,I totally agree with you. The deed is done.The pics are out there.And the recall button doesn’t work. But my intention in voicing my opinions is what Islam has always taught us…prevention.I am not here to judge or mete out punishment. That is all upto Allah, for He is the best arbitrator.
By jiah, 11/21/2006 @ 2:11 pm

Mr. Burton, in answer to your question, “are Muslim men required to cover themselves in the same manner? If not, why not?”

Absolutely. Both men and women are commanded in the Qur’an to “lower their gaze and be modest.” It is generally understood that men are not to expose the area of their body from the navel to the knee. However, many Muslim men would feel shy to expose a bare chest or bare legs in public. As with women, men are not to wear clothing that is tight or see-through. Indeed, in many Muslim societies the traditional clothing for men includes long, flowing robes, or long tunics that fully cover the body.
By Larry D. Burton, 11/22/2006 @ 2:58 pm

Okay, but here’s the problem I have with this. It seems like only Muslim women are subjected to any disdain for not fully covering up. There is a popular TV series called “Lost” that has a Muslim man as one of the main characters. He walks around on this island in shorts and an “A” shirt. Yeah, this is fairly modest attire but, still, he’s not covered to his hands and the shirt does a good job of showing off how muscular his chest is. Nothing is said about this. No one ever mentions Muslim men being immodest in the media. Yet, let a Muslim woman enter a bikini contest in a bikini that is very modest by the rest of the world’s standards and she gets condemned by her country for claiming her Pakistani heritage.

If you are going to get upset about Mariyah I would expect at least as much be made of a Muslim man also showing a lack of modesty. Jiah, maybe you do get upset by it but it doesn’t make the news. Does it?
By topspin, 11/23/2006 @ 7:48 pm

Jiah, Ms. Moten shows no remorse, nor intent to repent. What then?

SURELY, Jiah, I am misreading your reply? You basically say: Her behavior is wrong and brings shame on herself, her family, Pakistan, and Islam itself, but it’s done so she should be counselled NOT to do this again, so she and others can be prevented from such behavior. Allah will handle punishment and judgement.

Are you suggesting that agrees with The Holy Koran and Hadith teachings concerning public apostates? Might I remind you this quote from The Holy Koran 5:33 “The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His apostle and strive to make mischief in the land is only this, that they should be murdered or crucified or their hands and their feet should be cut off on opposite sides or they should be imprisoned; this shall be as a disgrace for them in this world, and in the hereafter they shall have a grievous chastisement,”

As this woman has shown NO REMORSE and is in fact encouraging other Muslim women to enter such contests and dress in such a manner in public, are you willing to suggest she should be merely counselled and then, if she doesn’t repent, allowed to continue to lead others astray? Is that what you suggest?
By Tufail, 12/18/2006 @ 12:02 pm

Woow, What a girl, fit to get laid.
Tufail
By Larry D. Burton, 12/20/2006 @ 9:47 pm

Tufail, this attitude that you are displaying is something I can’t understand. Can you not control yourself? This is a very modest bikini if you can’t control yourself around someone dressed like this you are the one that should be sanctioned, not Ms Moten.
By me, 12/20/2006 @ 11:03 pm

Quote: if you can’t control yourself around someone dressed like this you are the one that should be sanctioned, not Ms Moten. Unquote.

Thank you Mr. Burton. That was VERY well said. That quote should definitely be framed in Pakistan.
By rickey, 1/15/2007 @ 6:22 am

I Live in houston , texas and go to University of Houston.I don’t understand why is it such a big deal that a muslim girl took part in a bikini contest??

My question to all the people against he is that where is islam when there are women being raped and abused by men everyday,there is no justice,pakistani government is corrupt, you can pay off almost anyone to get your work done,rich is getting richer and poor is getting poorer.

And now all the muslim extremists have an excuse to burn down some buses, KFCs and McDonalds, without even thinking for once that they all are owned by their muslim brothers.Idiots!!
By tariq, 1/22/2007 @ 1:37 am

Personally I am strictly against this act… i am a muslim and i know this is totally un islamic… because when MS. Mariya Moten was going to the stage she was representing herself as a muslim…nobody will say ohh see there is a pakistani model… but i thing this act is not such alarming for the people…when we look around don’t we see what is going on in the society. I mean schools, colleges and universities… there are thousands of Ms. Mariya and Mr. Tufail. I do apologize to be so straightforward but this is the fact. There are a large persentage of people who wants Pakistan to become a sex free country where women especially get a dominant hand. Ms Mariya has only dared to go in an international contest but there are a lots of girls who are desperate to get a chance even in the blue films. and their brothers and parents wants to support them. And more over I have to cut a sorry figure that people like Ms Jiya can’t do anything. I think if Ms Mariya is as desperate why not to change her religion. I know it is unislamic to suggest someone like that but the step she took will be a gateway for others.
By sana, 2/17/2007 @ 5:29 pm

was good to see Pakistani girl representing in Beauty contest wearing a Bikini why people are shy to see beauty i think Pakistani women should dress trendy shorts kneelength Skirts
By jiah, 2/18/2007 @ 1:55 pm

Here we go again….
By Shaheryar, 2/26/2007 @ 10:13 am

I strongly support Miss Mariyah Moten and will continue to do. Mariyah Moten we are with you
By krymar, 3/7/2007 @ 10:42 pm

Is she even confirmed as being Muslim? I am sure many progressives will agree with her actions, but they are not Muslim.
By Larry D. Burton, 3/8/2007 @ 9:08 pm

She claims to be Muslim. I guess whether or not she really is would be between her and God. The rest of us just have to take her word for it.
By shhh, 3/28/2007 @ 7:05 pm

dude shes ugly and has no body! so even if she was to show it! its her disgrace not any1 else’s… also.. if some1 wants to participate in a pageant arent there preliminaries? how could u just represent a whole ENTIRE country without their knowledge. This is where she went wrong.
By summera, 4/4/2007 @ 7:38 am

Mariyah, you are awesome in the beauty contest. Your face expressions and body physique clearly tells that you would be the queen of porn stars if you start working in the x-rated movies. Gang bang would be good for your satisfaction.
By Zia, 9/11/2007 @ 1:48 am

Wow Summera that’s pretty disgusting. Keep you freakish comments to your self. Just because you might enjoy exrated films does not mean that you should include miss moten in you degarding suggestions.
By Mehdi Khan, 1/13/2008 @ 11:13 am

People like summera and tufail make such comments only when they see scantily dressed women. This is another reason why Allah commands women to cover themselves so that people like summera and tufail don’t make such lewd and dirty comments
By Larry D. Burton, 1/13/2008 @ 7:53 pm

Mehdi Khan,

Summera and Tufail are responsible for their mind being in the gutter, not Ms Moten.
By Ali, 2/2/2008 @ 9:19 am

In my opinion it is really stupid for all of us to argue on this matter. For those who are muslims and have read islam in detail know that this act is not allowed at all in islam. Also I do not say that what other bad stuff that muslim (specially men) do is allowed. But we cannot commit a sin saying that since most of men in islam do such nasty stuff so whats wrong if a woman is doing so. When we all die Allah will only account us for our deeds not deeds of others.
Also Allah is most forgiving so if that girl really repent Allah may forgive her.
May Allah guide all of us. For those of you who are saying all bad to islam you have all the right to say all of this. But remember message of Islam has been given to you so accept it or reject it its your choice and soon when we all die we will see the truth.
By Anas, 3/17/2008 @ 4:46 am

yeah ur right Larry this is a very good act. But you can take a better step by sending your mother, sister, and wife or girl friends in this line and see her in bikini. Coz that makes you happy then try with ur own family.